ID-FRONTIERS for February 17-23, 2002

Messages are displayed in the order they were received.  Subject  From  Date   Time   Kamchatka Gull? in MA (Long)/apologies for snafu   Jim Barton    Sun, 17 Feb 2002   4:08am   B.C. Collared Dove specimen   Don Cecile    Sun, 17 Feb 2002   8:39pm   Gray-headed Junco in PA   Rudy Keller    Mon, 18 Feb 2002   7:43am   Re: Gray-headed Junco in PA   Alan Wormington    Mon, 18 Feb 2002   11:11am   Re: Gray-headed Junco in PA   Diane and Kayo Roy    Mon, 18 Feb 2002   11:35am   RFI: Recent Developments in Kelp Gull ID and Taxonomy?   Phil Davis    Mon, 18 Feb 2002   12:38pm   Re: RFI: Recent Developments in Kelp Gull ID and Taxonomy?   Jean Iron    Mon, 18 Feb 2002   1:37pm   African Corncrake 1st for the Western Palearctic   =?iso-8859-1?Q?Ricar   Mon, 18 Feb 2002   4:10pm   Costa's, Anna's, or hybrid? You be the judge   creagrus    Tue, 19 Feb 2002   1:40pm   Mountain Quail sexing   ian paulsen    Wed, 20 Feb 2002   10:57am   Re: Re 4 : TRUE BLUE Morph Ross's Goose??   Bruce Deuel    Wed, 20 Feb 2002   8:03pm   Re: Gray-headed Junco in PA   Liis Veelma    Fri, 22 Feb 2002   8:05am   FW: [EBN] ID INFO, birds in captivity   Menotti Passarella    Sat, 23 Feb 2002   11:08am

To use email addresses replace '(AT)' with '@'. This is done to confuse the spam 'bots.

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Subject: Kamchatka Gull? in MA (Long)/apologies for snafu
From: Jim Barton <redwing1986(AT)ATTBI.COM>
Date: 17 Feb 2002 4:08am

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    Hello.  First, let me explain the snafu.  I sent this list an =
addendum to the original message below, which I thought I had sent to =
this list, but sent to Birdchat instead.  Hmmmm....

    Here's the original message intended for this list, now somewhat =
edited.=20

    Friends, I recently observed and photographed a very strange pseudo =
Ring-billed Gull or perhaps Common Gull or perhaps Kamchatka Gull. =
Unfortunately, as I later discovered, idiot Panasonic has not yet put =
out a driver which allows me to download the images in Windows XP.

    Thanks to several correspondents, I have now located some L.c.k. =
images.  I'll comment on those images after presenting the original =
description.     =20

    Herewith...Observation at Provincetown, MA, February 3, 2002.

    Size, as large if not larger than RingBG, several individuals of =
which were available for comparison.

    Eye,  DARK. =20
   =20
    Bill, large, but presenting NO swelling at tip, which, when present, =
 is usually a sure sign of RingBG. .  NO angle where the gonys should =
be.  Bill bluish gray at base.  At tip, large, VERY DIFFUSE smudge =
preceding dull yellow tip.  NOT a ring.  Smudge exactly as I would have =
expected on European Common Gull, L.(c.) canus, except that the bill of =
the observed bird was much larger and longer than I would have =
anticipated.  . =20

    Legs gray, tinged blue pinkish.  Wings, not noticeably attenuated, =
as I would have expected of Common Gull , of which Kamchatka Gull, =
L.c.kamtschatschensis, is considered a subspecies. =20

    Wing tips not seen.  A person was feeding gulls.  Everytime he threw =
more food, the gulls scattered.  Since I was trying to photograph the =
bird, I didn't have the use of my binoculars when the gulls scattered, =
then resettled. =20

    I do have one inadequate still photo of the bird.  But I don't know =
if it will be of much use.

    Your thoughts are solicited. [end of original description]

    Comments after seeing photos=3D.   I might have liked the mantle of =
the Ptown bird to have been darker.  But the photos show the apparent =
mantle shade of L.c.k to vary, just as RingBG does.  In addition, few of =
the Common Gulls I've seen in the U.S. have presented noticeably darker =
mantles.  In mantle tone, most have been inseparable from RingBG.

    In my addendum, I noted the apparent long legs of the bird, vs. what =
I would expect of Common.  Judging from the photographs, the leg length =
appears not to be an objection for L.c.k.   The leg color also appears =
okay, remembering that the bird was a winter bird.=20

    The apparent eye color of the Ptown bird bears some rather lengthy =
discussion. =20

    First, see the eye of L.c.k as portrayed in Nat Geo 3E p 199 and see =
also Dick Newell's photos and comments at this (incredibly long) URL.

    =
www.magikcircle.com/birds/dosearch.asp?keywords=3Dkamchatka&andor=3DAND&d=
ays=3D

    In Dick's photos, the iris can be seen to be pale.  Dick states, as =
Nat Geo shows, that the difference between Common and L.c.k is that in =
Kamchatka Gull the iris is pale while in Common it is dark.  But in the =
photos of Korean birds at the following URL the eye appears to be almost =
entirely dark, just as it did on the Ptown bird.  Only if you magnify =
the image using "Lens"  (available as freeware from ABF software), can =
you see that the iris is a shade lighter than the pupil. =20

    www.konju.ac.kr/srcho/guide1/gulls/kamcha.htm

    My thanks to Maureen Hickey for the above reference.=20

    Both Nat Geo 3E p. 199 and Collins p. 173 present winter adult =
L.c.canus with a dark eye similar to that of the Korean birds, and very =
different from the eye of adult RingBG, where the iris is a strong =
yellow and the dark pupil looks tiny. =20

    For me, what also argues strongly against RingBG is the bill =
structure and coloration---that is, the absence of swelling on both =
upper and lower mandible near the tip, plus the absence of an evident =
gonydal angle, plus the diffuse black smudge preceding the tip, where =
one would expect a well defined ring on adult RingBG, plus a pale to =
pale yellow tip, differing in color from the base of the bill preceding =
the dark smudge.  [But not differing as strongly as shown in Collins p. =
173 for both RingBG and Common Gull]

    What originally suggested Kamchatka Gull to me was the bill =
structure, dark eye, and large size.  Now I've learned that L.c.k should =
present a yellow iris, at least in winter adult.  Yet I see that the eye =
can appear all dark, as shown by the Korean birds.

    So was I looking a large Common?  The odds would certainly favor a =
large Common, but the only large Common that I've seen presented the =
short legs that I'd expect of that bird, not the long legs of the Ptown =
bird, which, as noted, appear to have been consistent with the legs of =
L.c.k as shown in the photos at the URLs above.

    Too bad I didn't get a good look at the primaries.  On adult =
L.(c.)canus P6 is crossed by a continuous black band, while on L.c.k, P6 =
is notched black on both sides.  See Nat Geo p. 199. =20

    Your comments are solicited.  Please note my new email address. =20
   =20
    Yours, Jim Barton

redwing1986(AT)attbi.com
brdbk(AT)aol.com
Cambridge, MA

Proact...campaigning for birds and their habitats,=20
before it's too late
www.proactnow.org

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Subject: B.C. Collared Dove specimen
From: Don Cecile <dcecile(AT)SD22.BC.CA>
Date: 17 Feb 2002 8:39pm

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I had an opportunity today to see the Doves that have been reported from
the Similkameen Valley.  Based on the birds that I was able to see and hear
well, I could see no reason for not arriving at a Eurasian Collared Dove
ID.  However a few interesting questions do remain.

Key features noted:   the birds do call in a manner that matches
descriptions I have available for the species.  The primaries are
noticeably darker than the rest of the body.  The undertail pattern shows
blackish outer webs to the bases of the tail feathers and the undertail
coverts are gray and blend very nicely with the rest of the body.  (white
undertail coverts would contrast significantly)  On the few birds (of 50-60
total) that I was able to see well, the undertail coverts were gray.

Specimen: while I was collecting feathers for possible DNA testing that
could help lead to definitive ID, I  discovered a dead bird.  This specimen
does have gray undertail coverts.  I would like to make the specimen
available to a researcher/museum for a more thorough identification.

lingering questions:  1.  why do some of the birds in this population have
white undertail coverts?
2.  if indeed this is a Eurasian Collared-Dove population that is 30 yrs
old, why have they not spread in a fashion similar to the Florida birds?

If you would like to point me in the direction of a researcher that could
make use of the specimen (or some of its feathers) for ID, please respond
to me privately.

Cheers,

Don Cecile
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Subject: Gray-headed Junco in PA
From: Rudy Keller <rkeller(AT)TEMPLE.EDU>
Date: 18 Feb 2002 7:43am

On Nov. 16, '01, a 'Gray-headed Junco' appeared at the birdbath of a birder
near Leesport, Berks Co., SE PA, who was familiar with the form from visits to
NM. It did not reappear after Nov. 16. He had a good long look at the bird as
it bathed in an in-ground birdbath near his window. He wrote a good
description, which has been forwarded to the PA Ornithological Records
Committee. I know of no other record of this form in PA. Rising's sparrow book
notes an Ontario record. I've heard there might be Ohio records. Does anyone
know of other records of this form in the East? Many thanks.

Rudy Keller
Boyertown, PA
Berks County


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Subject: Re: Gray-headed Junco in PA
From: Alan Wormington <wormington(AT)JUNO.COM>
Date: 18 Feb 2002 11:11am

There are two Ontario records:

one in May at Point Pelee.

another in spring (?) in Haliburton (?) District.

Unfortunately I am not at home so can not provide details.

Alan Wormington

On Mon, 18 Feb 2002 09:43:35 -0500 Rudy Keller <rkeller(AT)TEMPLE.EDU>
writes:
> On Nov. 16, '01, a 'Gray-headed Junco' appeared at the birdbath of a
> birder
> near Leesport, Berks Co., SE PA, who was familiar with the form from
> visits to
> NM. It did not reappear after Nov. 16. He had a good long look at
> the bird as
> it bathed in an in-ground birdbath near his window. He wrote a good
> description, which has been forwarded to the PA Ornithological
> Records
> Committee. I know of no other record of this form in PA. Rising's
> sparrow book
> notes an Ontario record. I've heard there might be Ohio records.
> Does anyone
> know of other records of this form in the East? Many thanks.
>
> Rudy Keller
> Boyertown, PA
> Berks County


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Subject: Re: Gray-headed Junco in PA
From: Diane and Kayo Roy <kayoroy(AT)NIAGARA.COM>
Date: 18 Feb 2002 11:35am

Hello Alan and BIRDWG members:

With Alan out of the country, I looked up the 2 records he referred to.

They are:  one bird, 25 May 1997, Huntsville, Muskoka District, and one
bird, 09 May 1989, Point Pelee National Park, Essex District.  Photographs
were privided for both observations.

Kayo

Kayo Roy
Secretary, OBRC
13 Kinsman Court
Fonthill, ON
L0S 1E3

----- Original Message -----
From: Alan Wormington <wormington(AT)JUNO.COM>
To: <BIRDWG01(AT)listserv.arizona.edu>
Sent: Monday, February 18, 2002 12:58 PM
Subject: Re: [BIRDWG01] Gray-headed Junco in PA

There are two Ontario records:

one in May at Point Pelee.

another in spring (?) in Haliburton (?) District.

Unfortunately I am not at home so can not provide details.

Alan Wormington

On Mon, 18 Feb 2002 09:43:35 -0500 Rudy Keller <rkeller(AT)TEMPLE.EDU>
writes:
> On Nov. 16, '01, a 'Gray-headed Junco' appeared at the birdbath of a
> birder
> near Leesport, Berks Co., SE PA, who was familiar with the form from
> visits to
> NM. It did not reappear after Nov. 16. He had a good long look at
> the bird as
> it bathed in an in-ground birdbath near his window. He wrote a good
> description, which has been forwarded to the PA Ornithological
> Records
> Committee. I know of no other record of this form in PA. Rising's
> sparrow book
> notes an Ontario record. I've heard there might be Ohio records.
> Does anyone
> know of other records of this form in the East? Many thanks.
>
> Rudy Keller
> Boyertown, PA
> Berks County


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Subject: RFI: Recent Developments in Kelp Gull ID and
         Taxonomy?
From: Phil Davis <pdavis(AT)IX.NETCOM.COM>
Date: 18 Feb 2002 12:38pm

All -

The Maryland/DC Records Committee is preparing for it's Annual Meeting this
Saturday, February 23, 2002. One of the issues on the agenda deals with our
Sandgates, Maryland Kelp Gull. This is a request for information ...

Are any birdwg01 subscribers aware of any recent citations or other
developments in Kelp Gull (Larus dominicanus) identification or taxonomy,
specifically with regard to subspeciation and/or potential splits?

The literature appears to be in conflict.

The species account in the 1996 The Handbook of Birds of the World, Vol 9
(Del Hoyo, et al.) indicates that there are no recognized subspecies.  A
paper by Pierre-Andre Crochet et al. "Molecular phylogeny and plumage
evolution in gulls (Larini): J Evol Biol 13, 47-57, 2000 also seems to not
support subspeciation, however, this work was focused on New Zealand and
Indian Ocean birds, not South American birds. Neither Sibley and Monroe nor
Clements 5th edition checklist indicate any subspecies.

On the other hand, a web page by Professor Les Underhill
(http://www.uct.ac.za/depts/stats/adu/species/sp312_00.htm) states "The
subspecies found along the southern African coastline, L. d. vetula, is
currently thought to be sufficiently different from the nominate race that
it ought to be regarded as a full species".

Again, any current insights based on publications or work-in-progress
related to the problems of L. dominicanus subspeciation or splits based on
DNA, external measurements, or any other techniques would be greatly
appreciated.

Thanks in advance.

Feel free to respond directly or to the list. I'm sure many subscribers are
interested in this topic.

Phil

===================================================
Phil Davis, Secretary
MD/DC Records Committee
2549 Vale Court
Davidsonville, Maryland  21035     USA
301-261-0184
mailto:PDavis(AT)ix.netcom.com

MD/DCRC Web site:  http://www.MDBirds.org/mddcrc/rcindex.html
===================================================


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Subject: Re: RFI: Recent Developments in Kelp Gull ID and
         Taxonomy?
From: Jean Iron <jeaniron(AT)SYMPATICO.CA>
Date: 18 Feb 2002 1:37pm

See "Identification of Kelp Gull" in the 2001 Birding World, volume 14,
pages 112-125 by F. Jiguet, A. Jaramillo and I. Sinclair. Discusses ID,
aging/plumages, molt, subspecies, vagrants, many photos, etc.

Ron Pittaway
Ontario Field Ornithologists
OFO Web: www.ofo.ca

At 01:59 PM 2/18/2002 -0500, you wrote:
>All -
>
>The Maryland/DC Records Committee is preparing for it's Annual Meeting this
>Saturday, February 23, 2002. One of the issues on the agenda deals with our
>Sandgates, Maryland Kelp Gull. This is a request for information ...
>
>Are any birdwg01 subscribers aware of any recent citations or other
>developments in Kelp Gull (Larus dominicanus) identification or taxonomy,
>specifically with regard to subspeciation and/or potential splits?
>
>The literature appears to be in conflict.
>
>The species account in the 1996 The Handbook of Birds of the World, Vol 9
>(Del Hoyo, et al.) indicates that there are no recognized subspecies.  A
>paper by Pierre-Andre Crochet et al. "Molecular phylogeny and plumage
>evolution in gulls (Larini): J Evol Biol 13, 47-57, 2000 also seems to not
>support subspeciation, however, this work was focused on New Zealand and
>Indian Ocean birds, not South American birds. Neither Sibley and Monroe nor
>Clements 5th edition checklist indicate any subspecies.
>
>On the other hand, a web page by Professor Les Underhill
>(http://www.uct.ac.za/depts/stats/adu/species/sp312_00.htm) states "The
>subspecies found along the southern African coastline, L. d. vetula, is
>currently thought to be sufficiently different from the nominate race that
>it ought to be regarded as a full species".
>
>Again, any current insights based on publications or work-in-progress
>related to the problems of L. dominicanus subspeciation or splits based on
>DNA, external measurements, or any other techniques would be greatly
>appreciated.
>
>Thanks in advance.
>
>Feel free to respond directly or to the list. I'm sure many subscribers are
>interested in this topic.
>
>Phil
>
>===================================================
>Phil Davis, Secretary
>MD/DC Records Committee
>2549 Vale Court
>Davidsonville, Maryland  21035     USA
>301-261-0184
>mailto:PDavis(AT)ix.netcom.com
>
>MD/DCRC Web site:  http://www.MDBirds.org/mddcrc/rcindex.html
>===================================================


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Subject: African Corncrake 1st for the Western Palearctic
From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Ricard_Guti=E9rrez?= <GUTARB(AT)TERRA.ES>
Date: 18 Feb 2002 4:10pm

As I said some days ago it's now online a web page devoted to the 1st record
of African Corncrake (Crex egregia) in the Western Palearctic, a bird that
arrived in bad condition to Tenerife, Canary Islands, Spain, last November
and died the day after. The bird was initially taken by a Common Rail Rallus
aquaticus but it quickly appeared to be something unique. There are a number
of pictures of the bird and a complete account on the bird characteristics,
biometrics and sighting at http://www.rarebirdspain.net

Besides, a plea to save the last pairs in the World of the endemic
subspecies of Lesser Short-toed Lark Calandrella rufescens rufescens in
Tenerife is also organized from the same crake page. Please have a look.

Yours

Ricard Gutiérrez
http://www.rarebirdspain.net


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Subject: Costa's, Anna's, or hybrid? You be the judge
From: creagrus <creagrus(AT)MONTEREYBAY.COM>
Date: 19 Feb 2002 1:40pm

An interesting male hummingbird was at a feeder in Santa Cruz, central
California, last month. When discovered we called it a male Costa's but
others reviewing photos suggest a hybrid or backcross with Anna's. I
have put together a page with lots of photos of both Calypte species and
of the mystery bird, and have appended both my comments and those of
Kumaran Arul. Additional comments from anyone with expertise on this
topic are most welcome. If anything, it does suggest that molt and/or
wear in this genus may produce unexpected i.d. problems.

The page is at http://montereybay.com/creagrus/SCZhumm.html

Cheers, Don Roberson


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Subject: Mountain Quail sexing
From: ian paulsen <ipaulsen(AT)KRL.ORG>
Date: 20 Feb 2002 10:57am

HI ALL:
 I was wondering if there is a way to sex Mountain Quails in the
field? The guide books mostly say no. Some guide books say females are
browner than the males but others say this coloration is due to
subspecific variation. Any comments??

Ian Paulsen
Bainbridge Island, WA, USA
ipaulsen(AT)krl.org
A.K.A.: "Birdbooker"
"Rallidae all the way"


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Subject: Re: Re 4 : TRUE BLUE Morph Ross's Goose??
From: Bruce Deuel <bkrdeuel(AT)SNOWCREST.NET>
Date: 20 Feb 2002 8:03pm

Sorry to take so long responding, but I had to find the reference.
McLandress and McLandress 1979 (Auk 96:544-550) is the definitive paper on
the question of whether blue morph Ross's Geese exist.  They do, as we have
known in California since that time.  Most blue morph birds we see here are
no different in size or bill characters than white morph.  Hybrids do exist,
also.  McLandress addresses this issue, too.
Cheers,
Bruce Deuel
Red Bluff, CA
----- Original Message -----
From: "Martin Reid" <upupa(AT)AIRMAIL.NET>
To: <BIRDWG01(AT)listserv.arizona.edu>
Sent: Saturday, February 16, 2002 9:18 AM
Subject: Re: [BIRDWG01] Re 4 : TRUE BLUE Morph Ross's Goose??

> Dear all,
> To add to this debate, here are some (not too great) images of three "Blue
> Ross's" from Texas during the same winter; two were in the same flock of
> 120+ Ross's and 2,000+ Snows.
> http://members.tripod.com/~tbrc/brossgo.html
> The Ribbles have extensive video of the first two birds, but at a
distance;
> I believe that Matt White has good video of the Tawakoni bird.  The first
> bird is a juv/1B ( when do juv Chens molt?) - and thus is the first of
this
> age to appear in this discussion.
> I would say that judging bill size/shape from just one or two cuts can be
> misleading...In the field I studied the imm. bird at length via my scope,
> and felt that its bill size and shape were the same as the Ross's it was
> with, and its overall size and structure was identical; the adult-type
bird
> in the same flock looked to be a tad smaller than most of the nearby
Ross's
> (I have one image showing this) - but I was not able to study the bill
well
> enough to make a statement about it.
>
> Has anyone else noticed that first-winter Ross's tend to look "different"
> about the head, in that the bill APPEARS larger/deeper than on adutls?
> (they also tend to look more "bull-necked" than adults, to my eye).  I
> suspect that some of this is an optical illusion created by the subtle
> dusky tones ahead and behind the eye and around the bill, but is there a
> true, measurable difference in bill structure between imms and
> adults?  look at the imms in the pics of the Nov 2001 Sacramento bird
here:
> http://fog.ccsf.org/~jmorlan/gallery.htm
> - and this bird from the UK:
> http://www.surfbirds.com/Rarities/ukstoppress-nov0106.html - and again
here:
> http://birdingpix.topcities.com/rosssgoose.htm - is this a pure Ross's - ?
> I've seen published photos of "Ross's" with a strong grinning patch
> (possibly in Birding World or Dutch Birding?) and:
> - the head close- up in "Handbook of Waterfowl Identification" by Frank S.
> Todd shows an adult with a dead-straight baseline, but a definite -
small -
> grinning patch
> -Plate 16 in "California Birds" by Arnold Small shows an adult with dead
> straight baseline, but longish bill and hint of grinning patch
> -in the "Audubon Soc. Master Guide to Birding" both birds have a small
> curve at the top of the baseline, and the imm's bill looks longish
> -in the Kaufman Guide note the dark areas above/below the bill on the imm,
> and how this affects our perception of the bill proportions compared  to
> the adult (assuming these pics have not been retouched in this area)
> http://www.fnal.gov/ecology/wildlife/specs/Rosss_Goose.html - straight
> baseline, but "big" bill and sloping forehead
> http://www.camacdonald.com/birding/DesJardin/Ross'sGoose(DD).JPG - bills
> look very untypical!
> http://pintolake.com/rossgoose.htm - much closer to "normal", but still
> rather large bill, with sloping forehead
> http://azwildbird.com/birdfoto/goose/ross.htm - close-up bird seems to
have
> a curve at the top of the baseline, and a hint of a grin; the "pair" both
> look long-billed and the near bird has a curved baseline
>
http://personal.riverusers.com/~ghrosenberg/Arizona%20Photos/BlueRossGoose.h
tml
> - a blue adult; the bill appears to be a bit odd, but hard to be certain
> http://www.greglasley.net/snowross.html - the Ross's has a curve at the
> bottom of the baseline
> http://www.citruscounty-fl.com/Gallery/pic20.jpg - from Florida - is the
> culmen a bit too "straight"?
> http://lupus.northern.edu:90/tallmand/ross.html - a Blue specimen; the
bill
> is tiny, but note the ginning patch and slight curve to the baseline
> The question that comes to mind is: how much of this variation is within
> the pure Ross's gene pool, and how much is due to hybridization
> with/introgression from Snow?  This ID issue has not been seriously
> addressed (to my knowledge) and is  important because a conservative
> interpretation of this variation ( i.e. it is all due to introgression
from
> Snow)  might lead to the invalidation of numerous records away from the
> expected range, and would mean that Ross's are NOT identifiable in flight
> any more (as  F1 or F2 hybrids cannot be ruled out on structure and size).
> Comments?
> Cheers,
> Martin
>
> At 2/16/2002 02:57 AM -0400, you wrote:
> >Michael Retter has written :
> > > It is my understanding that a "true" blue morph Ross' would
> > > show much more blue (...) However, the bird pictured from
> > > 15 April 1999 in the same photo gallery looks like what I
> > > think of when I hear "full" Blue morph Ross'--provided it's a
> > > full-blooded Ross' Goose that is--whatever that means.
> >_____________________________
> >
> >The 1999 bird has quite a long bill too. I don't think the coloration is
the
> >first thing to be taken in consideration to tell if a blue morph is a
pure
> >Ross's Goose. Such a bird must qualify structurally to be a pure Ross's
> >Goose at first. After finding one which qualifies, it will be time for
> >analyzing the coloration.
> >
> >The first question was about the existence of a true blue morph Ross's
> >Goose. That is a question I ask to myself too and for which I still
haven't
> >an answer. All what I can say is that I have never seen a blue morph
goose
> >being a true
> >Ross's Goose.
> >
> >A good answer perhaps should come from somebody seeing larger numbers of
> >Ross's yearly that we can see in the East. I see only between one and
five
> >Ross's a year here, putting a great emphasis in searching them. It is
great,
> >in spring and fall, to look for one among thousands of Snow Geese. Doing
so,
> >I have been able to see that some reported white Ross's Geese are, in
fact,
> >hybrids.
> >
> >Another question to which I'm searching an answer is if a pure Ross's can
> >have a grin line. Could it be that birds looking like Ross's with such a
> >dark line on bill are the result of introgression (and so not pure
Ross's) ?
> >
> >Salutations amicales...
> >
> >      MICHEL BERTRAND
> >      Sainte-Julie, Qc
> >      bertrmi(AT)colba.net
> >
> >Caressez longuement votre phrase, et elle finira par sourire.
> >-- Anatole France
>
> Martin Reid
> Fort Worth, Texas
> upupa(AT)airmail.net
> http://www.martinreid.com
>
>


[ << | >> | ^^ ]

Subject: Re: Gray-headed Junco in PA
From: Liis Veelma <lveelma(AT)MB.SYMPATICO.CA>
Date: 22 Feb 2002 8:05am

Apologies for the delay in answering, but I was getting the details from
Mark Huebert. The bird was first seen in his family's back yard near St
Vital Park in Winnipeg, Manitoba on November 9, 1999.  The last observation
was on March 4, 2000. I myself saw it on November 11.  Mark says "One thing
I can tell you is that it is the northern form (both mandibles light color)
of the Northern Rockies.  I also have some photos."

Liis Veelma
Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
lveelma(AT)mb.sympatico.ca


[ << | >> | ^^ ]

Subject: FW: [EBN] ID INFO, birds in captivity
From: Menotti Passarella <aster_men(AT)YAHOO.COM>
Date: 23 Feb 2002 11:08am

All

Could anyone help a friend of mine to identify these
two birds(south-american passerines?) in captivity?
http://digilander.iol.it/maudoc/xbirds/xbirds.htm
Send your ideas to maudoc(AT)libero.it

Thanks in advance

--
Maurizio Sighele

maudoc(AT)libero.it
maudoc birding: http://web.tiscali.it/maudoc_birding/

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